Talk: Server list

Any MCwiki Admin

Is it possible to create. An official minecraftwiki.net-server? Would be cool! NaNdummy 19:38, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

Agree, though this is off-topic. The Community Portal (see left sidebar) would be a better place for asking this. Last thing, I think the admins are busy enough already. Calinou - talk × contribs » 20:26, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

Actually, it would probably be best to see if Curse wanted to set up a server for the forum and wiki. 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 21:04, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

Server Listing sites?

Should these be categorized in a certain way? By date added or by alphabetical? --Hamburger helper 03:05, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

It's kept alphabetical, like other lists on the wiki (mods, texture packs, etc.). Arbitrary, but unambiguous, and it (mostly) keeps people from trying to promote things by moving them to the top of the list. -- Orthotope 05:12, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

While we're on the topic, I noticed the entire server list was deleted, but one remained. Any reason for this? Who decides what gets to be deleted and what is considered advertising? Should we parse the entire wiki and remove external links? --Hamburger helper 07:45, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

I boldly removed the list because I don't see the point in linking to dozens of different server list sites, many of which end up being created solely to be listed here and siphon some traffic, allowing them to make money via advertisements displayed there - or to serve malware and viruses and the like to visitors. In addition, linking to all and sundry dilutes the value of any one link; with so many choices, how is a person ever to know which site to look at or submit their server on?

I left the Reddit link because Reddit is a well-known, user-curated site that does not specialize in Minecraft-related topics and has no invested interests in them. The subreddit in question has a set of moderators and clear guidelines on what may be submitted and how, all of which helps to maintain the quality of the list.

I am perfectly willing to agree to a compromise on this - including a return to the previous indiscriminate list - if that is the community's consensus. 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 09:40, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

 Agreed for removal. --80.134.6.5 10:22, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

 Agreed I think we should just get rid of this page altogether then. Reddit is a great site, but they still feed off traffic and advertising too. If you can't monitor all the external links, then there shouldn't be any. Making this page rather useless.--Hamburger helper 18:19, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

 Disagree Reddit may be well-known, but Reddit still has for-profit advertisements, which was part of the argument for removal of the other server lists. The servers listed on these server listing sites generally accept donations or sell ranks and items. The server lists have every right to include advertisements to help support the costs of servers and development. Last I checked, the minecraft wiki has a plethora of advertisements. I see three at the bottom, one at the side, and one at the top of this very page. The point of that list was providing users a list of available server listings. I could see excluding a site if it did not meet the criteria of a server listing, but to exclude it for any other reason does not make any sense. In regards to the subreddit in question, they may have moderators and guidelines on what may be submitted and how, but many of the listings meet this same criteria. Many of these lists have clear guidelines as to what they allow on their sites, and quickly remove any listings that violate these guidelines. Additionally, Reddit may be well known, but often hosts questionable content that could be easily deemed inappropriate for MineCraft's most common audience. The average advertisement featured on a server listing is typically through Project Wonderful which does not allow questionable material or advertisements, and is most often utilized by server owners to advertise their servers. --Talaysen 01:10, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

Reddit's advertisements are completely separate from anything Minecraft-related, because Reddit itself is completely separate from anything Minecraft-related (regardless of whether it may have come to embrace Minecraft in any fashion over the past couple of years). I picked Reddit instead of another site because of this, and because if I had chosen some random site from the list, operators of the other sites on the list could be justifiably upset that the wiki appears to be playing favorites, but by choosing a site which is not controlled by anyone with vested interests, none of the operators of the other site should be upset (or, at least, everyone can be equally upset, instead of one person/site enjoying a favored status and everyone else being mad at the wiki and possibly that person/status).

Whether the wiki has advertisements elsewhere does not factor in on this particular instance. Note that some of the advertisements displayed on-wiki are outside of our control; the wiki is operated by Curse, which places advertisements in various positions on every page to help drive traffic between their sites - this is their prerogative, and the wiki community has no right to simply remove these advertisements (though we are more than free to make it known how we feel about this; if you have complaints about any such advertisement on the wiki, Wynthyst is probably the best person to let know). This is not a double standard, but simply a fact of life given that we are hosted by a for-profit company.

While Reddit certainly does host inappropriate content, all such content is relegated to individual subreddits which are age-restricted, and such content is typically immediately deleted elsewhere on the site (at least, this is my experience; keep in mind that I do little more on Reddit than just consume some content once in a while). 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 08:11, 15 August 2012 (UTC)

I've personally ran advertisements on Reddit that are directly related to MineCraft. Reddit allows outside advertisers to place content on their website, and does fairly little to ensure that content is appropriate. As long as I am paying, it is likely my ad will run.

Your counter-argument that, because Reddit is not solely a minecraft server listing host is the exact reason it should not be the site featured on this page. Reddit is not a server listing site. They have a subreddit (a sub portion of their site) that allows users to post a MineCraft server. You say that Reddits advertisements are completely unrelated to Minecraft, and somehow this adds relevance to it as a server listing or adds credibility to the website?

Somehow, profiting off of your visitors is acceptable as long as it isn't related to MineCraft?

The point here is, regardless of the advertising presented, it is still intended to support the costs of the site.

If you were picking something solely off the fact that it does not have a "vested" interest in being selected as the server list represented on this page, why would you not just use the MineCraft forum's server list, as it is likely better moderated than Reddit, and the advertisements "are not minecraft related".

You say that "many of which end up being created solely to be listed here and siphon some traffic". That seems very "we are the center of the universe". One would think that most of the server listing developers created their sites to provide a service and potentially earn money for providing that service by way of advertisements (just like Curse does with most of their sites).

Saying that they spent all the time and effort (and possibly expense) creating their sites just to siphon traffic from this site is purely speculative, and rather silly.

You mentioned: "allowing them to make money via advertisements displayed there"

Yet, you say that Curse and Reddit are allowed to do this because it supports the cost of their services. Why is it unacceptable for these server listing hosts to do the same? Should they pay all expenses related to their sites out of pocket?

" - or to serve malware and viruses and the like to visitors."

Again, without a single specific example of this, this is purely speculative, based off of an assumption or opinion. Most of these server listing hosts use Project Wonderful, which does not allow inappropriate advertisements or malware.

"In addition, linking to all and sundry dilutes the value of any one link; with so many choices, how is a person ever to know which site to look at or submit their server on?"

This page is describing a Server List. It describes the purpose and nature of a server list and why the server list exists. By representing one example of this, and choosing to deny representing any other examples, and phrasing it as "but a list is hand-maintained on Reddit", you are implying that Reddit is the implied source for players to find servers. These seems grossly inappropriate.

If you are not going to allow any of the server lists to be represented, then Reddit should not be represented. It counts as a "many third-party websites dedicated to listing Minecraft servers exist." and should not be given precedence over any of these other sites.

Reddit should be removed from this context and it should be left at "many third-party websites dedicated to listing Minecraft servers exist." Let players do their own research if you are not going to provide them with legitimate information.

--Talaysen 22:53, 15 August 2012 (UTC)

 Agreed for removal: this article started as a description of the in-game Minecraft feature, until a random user (who edits this page and this page alone) decided to add a list. Websites which list servers have no relevance to this page, as they have nothing to do with the in-game 'server list' feature. If we want to maintain links to websites which list servers, that should be at Lists of servers (which is shorter than the other title I had in mind, "List of lists of servers"). --timrem 23:05, 9 October 2012 (UTC)

 Agreed for removal: I agree with Timrem's reasoning, this is valid.

--Talaysen 21:44, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

 Agreed I also agree with Timrem's idea. I would also like to suggest a disambiguation page since server list, list of servers, and lists of servers can be pretty confusing. --Kanegasi ☺C 22:31, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

I've changed the redirect List of servers to be a disambiguation between these two pages, and added each to the other's "See Also" section. Hopefully this will help people find what they're looking for, but if we wanted, we could add a "This page is about X. For Y, see [here]" at the top. --timrem 23:31, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

The page Lists of servers should never have been created, and I've tagged it for deletion. Having the list on that page doesn't solve any of the problems with the list itself; it just moves said problems to a different page. The wiki is not the appropriate place to curate a list of server lists; either the forum or Reddit should be used. 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 23:36, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

Where is this stored?

Is the server list stored in the bin file? I'd imagine, but I'd like confirmation

Thanks –Preceding unsigned comment was added by 173.67.149.55 ^(Talk) 23:39, 11 January 2012 (UTC). Please sign your posts with ~~~~

The server list appears to be saved as "servers.dat" in the main ".minecraft" directory. --timrem 23:05, 9 October 2012 (UTC)

Deletion

I tagged this for deletion because most server list sites blatantly add a "Featured" Section right in your face at the top or above all other servers. The page should be deleted as well, because the Minecraft forum has a forum dedicated to this. We do not need it. Iyeru 04:56, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

As per my above argument, even if there are featured servers, it is still a list of MineCraft servers. There is still generally search functions available and many other methods of players selecting servers on which to play. This page is explaining the purpose and function of server listings, as there is no built in function with MineCraft that servers this purpose. Examples of this are warranted, as users should not have to leave the page and search the Internet to locate relevant information. Talaysen 01:15, 15 August 2012 (UTC)

Advertise

This is not fair this is advertising on the foto there are the server ip of savage realms –Preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.254.86.58 ^(Talk) 03:18, 2 August 2012 (UTC). Please sign your posts with ~~~~

thanks for the removal –Preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.254.86.58 ^(Talk) 02:05, 3 August 2012 (UTC). Please sign your posts with ~~~~